[SPOILERS] The Story of RDR2

[The_Lady_A 1,280]

 

A few folks have finished this now, and it is most certainly a story that can provoke thoughts. Adding into the fact that there are apparently four different endings, there is going to be the risk of spoilers for a long old time I suspect.

This thread is intended as the place for open discussion of the plot, or plots depending on how much impact the moral decision have, of Red Dead 2. Stop reading now if spoilers are a thing that worries you.

[Jesse 867]

Spoiler tags to make sure.. DO NOT READ IF YOU'VE NOT FINISHED STORY!

 

I've been waiting for a post like this to discuss some things

 

I loved it, thought it was like a movie. Some moments really moved me and I was very sad to see some of the friendly faces go. I started hating Dutch quite early on. Having not played RDR1, so not knowing he would live through it all, I would've gladly gotten rid of him.  I only know about two of the possible endings, mine being the one going for money instead of helping John reach his family. Since I thought it might help out later. Did not quite realise that would be the end of playing as Arthur.

I was quite sad when I realised Arthur wouldn't be back, nor would my lovely spotty horse, I actually ran back to her to see if reviving was possible haha. RIP. Overall I'm very happy with the story. Might have to play it again one day.

 

Edited November 11, 2018 by Jesse

[DavidCore89 7,404]

Finally, been struggling to keep it to myself 

I thought the story was truly fantastic, moving and quite emotional at times. I loved how close the group were, but I could see that they were slowly turning on one another.

Arthur had tuberculosis, possibly caught it from one of the stranger quests, not sure, but I knew he was going to die, and sure enough he got worse with time.

I helped John escape as the money would mean nothing to a dying Arthur. I was glad with my choice as John later went back to kill Micah, but Dutch did it and then walked away, leaving John with the 20K stash, so I'm sure we'll see Dutch again.

I did start to hate Dutch, despite thinking he was a great leader of the gang early on. I wanted to kill the snake, even though he did save John at the end, but that can wait.

I was happy that a few of the gang had made it out alive and had plans to build lives of their own.

By far the best story I've ever played, exceeded my expectations as well.

I probably won't play the story again. The way it turned out is the way it'll stay for me.

Edited November 6, 2018 by DavidCore89

[Wulfherth 100]

He caught it from Downes. The one money collection that the games forces you to go to. He coughs in your face.

And Arthur talks about how he's dying because of the guy he beat up over a few dollars.

 

I hated Dutch right from the beginning.

His dumb posh music and his tent.His attempts to sound intelligent by quoting philosophy.

Him calling people his "son"

More especially so when when they come back from that fishing trip when they remember the old days (Arthur, Dutch, and Hosea).

He slips up and says "i think i'll-- we'll be just fine" 

He's a selfish conman trying to con himself and con everyone around him into thinking that all this robbing, killing, and bs is about a higher cause.

He broke at the end because he got out of the denial he was in. He's realized he's just another outlaw, no one fancy.

Edited November 7, 2018 by Wulfherth

[The_Lady_A 1,280]

On 11/7/2018 at 3:16 PM, Wulfherth said:

He caught it from Downes. The one money collection that the games forces you to go to. He coughs in your face.

And Arthur talks about how he's dying because of the guy he beat up over a few dollars.

I was wondering whether or not it was possible to avoid the TB fate entirely by skipping that mission.

[DavidCore89 7,404]

I think so.

Wish I did as Arthur was less effective with TB.

Each time Micah called him black lung I wanted to punch his face into the 20th century.

[Jjss924 576]

Haven't finished yet, on ch 6. I've disliked Dutch from the beginning. He's transparent. It's sometimes irritating to go along with the story, watching Arthur get conned repeatedly. Great story overall. The best part so far was fighting my way out of Guarma. Micah would have been dead by ch 2 if I had it my way.

[The_Lady_A 1,280]

I was actually quite impressed with the character arcs of both Dutch and Arthur. Dutch in RDR1 is treated very much like Kurtz from Heart of Darkness/Apocalypse Now, a great man who has fully descended into darkness and brutality by the time we meet him. 

In RDR2 by linking the redemption of the protagonist with the fall of his icon, I feel the writers managed to personalise and add tension to what is already a foregone conclusion for anyone who completed RDR1. While most video game betrayals are a sudden affair played for shock value, Arthur's loyalty to Dutch until almost the very end adds a real sense of tragedy to it all. All of the little betrayals adding up over time finally resulting in an existential crisis for Arthur,  ultimately giving him the agency to make his own decisions and to escape the spiral of madness that Dutch had fallen into.

It was oddly refreshing to see the development of the villain from the inside, to be one of Kurtz followers rather than the Marlow/Willard being sent in right at the very end and only seeing them at their most villainous.

[Wulfherth 100]

4 hours ago, The_Lady_A said:

I was wondering whether or not it was possible to avoid the TB fate entirely by skipping that mission.

It's not possible. It forces you to go by making it a story mission marker and cutscene if you haven't done it by a point in Chapter 3. Also even before that its highlighted as yellow not white so it's unavoidable. Arthur's TB only has negative effects after Guarma so stop at Ch4 if you want to free roam without being ill.

Edited November 9, 2018 by Wulfherth

[Jjss924 576]

@The_Lady_A good analogy. I have a hard time relating to Arthur in that regard I suppose. It feels unnatural to follow a weak leader like Dutch. 

Edited November 9, 2018 by Jjss924

[Danielle 3,007]

I don't think I've ever felt so emotional over a game.

I'm still on part 2 of the epilogue but I feel so heartbroken, it actually feels like I have lost a friend. I had to take a moment when Arthur said goodbye to his horse, shouldn't have named her after my dog... the first time I have cried playing a game.

The 4 endings are pretty much the same, the choice to go with John or not and then variations on those depending on whether you are honourable or not. I was honourable and went with John.

[The_Lady_A 1,280]

Yes finally finished finished the game. The morality system did an excellent job of pretending to matter, it had me fooled.

I can think of two moments that had the greatest impact for me. Arthur's diagnosis of TB, that whole sequence was a wonderful surprise with enough foreshadowing to make it stick. Rockstar railroading actually being used to further the story well rather than just protect their precious mission sequencing. It was an excellent touch of powerlessness and hopelessness. In many ways that's the point that the Redemption arc kicked off.

Then clearing out the final camp with Charles, especially if you went by canoe. The oppressive darkness and brutality of that mission, I felt it was a good nod to the Heart of Darkness themes in Dutch's arc. Instead of going into the jungle after Kurtz, we were clearing the way for him to follow. 

But what cemented the impact of this was Molly showing up at the end of that mission, and being murdered in cold blood by Susan. That moment absolutely shocked me, it was so sudden and surprising and brutal.

The infighting at the camp that followed, all of the show don't tell storytelling as every little tension that had been building up in the literal real world days of play needed to get to that point just errupting out into the open. It was just excellent payoff for such an unrelenting slow burning story.

 

[Fido_le_muet 5,198]

Finished the game last night.

I loved the story. I kinda knew that Arthur would die at the end since he's not mentionned in RDR1 at all. And when he got TB, I knew that was how he would go. 

It was emotionnal at times and it moved me but I wouldn't say it was the most emotionnal game I played. The Last Of Us was it for me but RDR2 is up there. 

Loved Sadie's arc. From weak widow to ruthless bounty hunter. I thought there would be a bit of romance at the end with Arthur but it didn't. And that's better that way. 

Hated Dutch from the beginning but that was because I knew the story of RDR1. I think they could have done a better job linking RDR2 with RDR1. In 1, John hates Dutch while in RDR2 he ultimately saves John's life. Sure he was a dick before that but... Same wil Bill and Javier. Marston hates them in RDR1 but they're not that bad in 2. They are dicks but they never antagonize John directly in the story. 

Also a few loopholes that I would have liked to be explained. What happened in Blackwater at the beginning ? It seemed important but maybe it was just a job gone wrong ? It's implied that the gang was set up but then that's it. Maybe it was Micah's action with the Pinkertons ? We'll never know. 

Same with the beginning of RDR1. John says he was left for dead by Dutch. We don't see that ingame. Unless he's speaking about the train job or his time at Sisika Penitentiary ? Yeah must be it. 

I like the credits where we see agents Ross and Fordham slowly picking up with John and if you know RDR1, you know how that's gonna end for John's family. 

Loved every second of it anyway. Having the main character die is not new in video games but having him die of something so "normal" as a disease, in a world full of outlaws and violence has a much bigger impact on the player. 

Well done Rockstar once again. 

Oh and calling it : RDR3 : Sadie Adler, Bounty Hunter  

Edited December 15, 2018 by Fido_le_muet

[The_Lady_A 1,280]

@Fido_le_muet John was very hesitant and reluctant about hunting down Dutch in RDR1, and repeatedly tries to argue that they were different and had a code. Also yes the left for dead is almost certainly a mix of being left in prison and abandoned after being wounded during the army train job. 

With Bill and especially Javier I think R* made the right decision by mostly ignoring the way they are in RDR1. They were very one dimensional in that which wouldn't have matched the gang in RDR2.

[Sinister 2,583]

Just have to do the epilogues.

Main story was ok but pretty predictable. Gang of clowns bumbling through one failure after another. Finally they turn on one another and splinter apart.

Micah was a cock sucker and I figured he was a rat in chapter 2, lol.

I had the Arthur dies part spoiled for me a few days into playing but thankfully I made the right choices and got the best ending.

That said,  fuck John, I want to play as Arthur, lol.

Wish I hadn't bothered buying horses and shit with Arthur. Same with collecting all that gold just to have it taken. Apparently I will end up with a nice chunk after the epilogues but I'm still pissed off

[Sinister 2,583]

Having finished the epilogue and watching my kids play my feelings on the story have changed. A lot of the side quests and other stuff are what really make the game great.

Also, you can go back as John and collect the gold bars again so I'm happy.

Just wish I had waited to do the Vetran missions so I would still have Buell. He is the only horse of that type with that coat. His stats are Custom as well.

[JustHatched 12,123]

I haven't played story mode since online came out, I am only going back to story some day to clean up some trophies for the Platinum. However I didn't really wanna play after Arthur died. I don't feel any love for John, so I made him look as close to my Arthur toon as possible.

By far the best story of any game, and better than alot of movies. 

[pete_95973 4,386]

13 hours ago, Hatch said:

I haven't played story mode since online came out, I am only going back to story some day to clean up some trophies for the Platinum. However I didn't really wanna play after Arthur died. I don't feel any love for John, so I made him look as close to my Arthur toon as possible.

By far the best story of any game, and better than alot of movies. 

I felt similarly.  John was okay and I liked playing as him to try to avenge Arthur, but other than that did not have much motivation.  Only just this past week did I finish the epilogue.  Story was fantastic overall though.

[Fido_le_muet 5,198]

I'm currently at my second playthrough. I missed a few trophies the first time around cause I wanted to finish the story quickly to avoid spoilers. 

It's actually very enjoyable to take my time and to get back to Arthur. John is cool but Arthur is much more fleshed out. 

I'm gonna try to do all the side quests before the end of Chapter 4. At least what I can. 

[Sinister 2,583]

1 hour ago, Fido_le_muet said:

 

I'm gonna try to do all the side quests before the end of Chapter 4. At least what I can. 

That's what I did since I knew what was coming. Some of the chapter 6 honor stuff was cool. Hamish was my favorite stranger.

Finding all the graves let me know that Charles is one bad dude. He buried Arthur in solid rock.

Will be playing through it again since I missed a few camp requests. Grinding out all the trophies now since it is pretty much all one can do in online anyways,  lol.